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Thread: Suntup Editions - All Books

  1. #721
    Senior Member Jeez! Don't you have anything better to do with your time? bookworm 1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian861 View Post
    But it's not shipped out of country like bookworm stated if we're talking about Suntup. At least not to Cap it isn't.
    My mistake J was thinking PS Publications. I was having a dyslexic kind of morning.

  2. #722
    Senior Member 1st Electroshock Session Sock Monkey's Avatar
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    I’m on the fence...again. I AM LEGEND is a stone cold classic by one of my favorite authors. I’d be all over the limited—it looks beautiful—but the price point is giving me a Grand Canyon sized pause. If it was near the same price point as BROTHER I’d have pulled the trigger already. Eye-balling the AGE, but I think I’d regret not getting the limited...

  3. #723
    Senior Member 1st Electroshock Session bsaenz24's Avatar
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    I can't understand the prices for the limited and lettered, considering they can't be signed. I'm sure they will be beautiful books, for $3500 for a lettered not signed by the author???? Seems crazy.

  4. #724
    Administrator Totally Insane Dan Hocker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsaenz24 View Post
    I can't understand the prices for the limited and lettered, considering they can't be signed. I'm sure they will be beautiful books, for $3500 for a lettered not signed by the author???? Seems crazy.
    I'm pretty sure the price point on these is all production value really. What Paul is trying to do is have sort of a "standard" so not matter what book it is, they all have sort of the same production value put into them. This then makes it so you have to price the editions relatively similarly across the board, no matter if there's a signature or not. So where he's able to "fudge" the numbers a bit is when he doesn't do a gift edition. So for example the limited for Brother is cheaper than I Am Legend, because he's doing a gift for I Am Legend and the limitation for I Am Legend is half of the limitation for Brother.

    His lettereds are so expensive because he's going all out on them. I'm pretty sure he prints all of his lettereds via letter press (and his more expensive limiteds too) which in of itself skyrockets the printing costs. Let alone the rest of the materials he uses.
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  5. #725
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement jeffingoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsaenz24 View Post
    I can't understand the prices for the limited and lettered, considering they can't be signed. I'm sure they will be beautiful books, for $3500 for a lettered not signed by the author???? Seems crazy.
    It's the materials and the craftsmanship. Full goatskin for the lettered, hand sewn and letterpress for the lettered and numbered. That all adds up. Having the numbered editions of HORNS and HILL HOUSE, I'll say the quality is amazing. You can feel where the money goes.

  6. #726
    Administrator Totally Insane Dan Hocker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    It's the materials and the craftsmanship. Full goatskin for the lettered, hand sewn and letterpress for the lettered and numbered. That all adds up. Having the numbered editions of HORNS and HILL HOUSE, I'll say the quality is amazing. You can feel where the money goes.
    I do see Brad's point a bit though. It seems more of a "why go to those lengths for a book that can't / won't be signed" kind of a thing. That said it's just what Paul is doing with his line of books. I hope it continues to work out for him.
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  7. #727
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement jeffingoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Hocker View Post
    I do see Brad's point a bit though. It seems more of a "why go to those lengths for a book that can't / won't be signed" kind of a thing. That said it's just what Paul is doing with his line of books. I hope it continues to work out for him.
    Oh yeah I see the point too. For a lot of folks, the signature from the author "legitimizes" the book. It's a literal endorsement of the edition. With Levin, Jackson, and Matheson, signatures were impossible. With McCarthy the signature was impossible for a different reason. But I would hate to see those books get passed by because a signature couldn't be acquired. And I would hate for Paul to do anything less than his best for these masterworks. I think all paths lead to the same price point. And as we saw with Rosemary's Baby, any signature meant to stand in for the author's can become a lightning rod for cynics.

  8. #728
    Administrator Totally Insane Dan Hocker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    Oh yeah I see the point too. For a lot of folks, the signature from the author "legitimizes" the book. It's a literal endorsement of the edition. With Levin, Jackson, and Matheson, signatures were impossible. With McCarthy the signature was impossible for a different reason. But I would hate to see those books get passed by because a signature couldn't be acquired. And I would hate for Paul to do anything less than his best for these masterworks. I think all paths lead to the same price point. And as we saw with Rosemary's Baby, any signature meant to stand in for the author's can become a lightning rod for cynics.
    Yea I dunno, it's just kinda a weird position to be in honestly. I've always wanted to do a "CD Does the classics" line or something like that, but without signatures and 100s of other editions of them, why would someone want to buy Dracula or Frankenstein (or the myriad of other horror classics) from us. Just a thought though.
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  9. #729
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement Ben Staad's Avatar
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    I've never thought these added any value to a book FWIW.

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    any signature meant to stand in for the author's can become a lightning rod for cynics.

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    Given the choice between a signed (by the author) numbered edition and an unsigned (or signed by whoever did the intro) numbered edition, I'll always opt for the numbered signed by the author for, I suppose, the reason mentioned by Jeff above...it legitimizes the edition, it shows an authorial seal of approval, a small involvement by the author that stamps it as the definitive deluxe edition. This is why I treasure my signed Easton of ROSEMARY'S BABY and my signed Gauntlet of I AM LEGEND, but had no interest in the not-signed-by-the-author Suntup editions of each novel (well, that and the high cost, especially given that I already had my editions). But since I do love LEGEND so damn much, I couldn't pass up the Gift Edition as just a second, very lovely edition to accompany my Gauntlet. I passed on ROSEMARY'S BABY altogther.

    All that to say that given the choice I'll opt for the edition signed by the author, but the lack of a signature doesn't preclude me from buying a book. For me, it's nice to have and I prefer it, but it's not essential. That said and using I AM LEGEND as an example, I don't believe I'd ever spend $700 on an unsigned numbered or $3500 on an unsigned lettered when one can snag a numbered signed by the author for (according to what I see on ABE) $400. I get that the production qualities of a Suntup far eclipse Gauntlet (those IAL is from the days when they actually did a pretty nice job), but I tend to value that authorial involvement and stamp of approval more than the origin of the paper or other subtle production elements.

  11. #731
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement jeffingoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Staad View Post
    I've never thought these added any value to a book FWIW.
    Yeah it all depends. But that's a selection (much like the artist) that opens the door to criticism for the publisher. I'd imagine it's so much easier when the author is alive and agrees to sign. The selection is made for the publisher. But when that's not the case, people will wonder and worry over the connection of the signer to the work. It's a legitimate question for sure. I'm thrilled to be getting a Chuck Palahniuk signature in Rosemary's Baby. And a Joyce Carol Oates signature in The Road. Though I see them as cherries on top. Awesome to have, and adding value for me, but secondary to the materials and production.

    Compared to Gauntlet's lettered edition of RUSTY PUPPY--the only thing that added value to the edition was the inclusion of James Purefoy's signature along with Lansdale's. The quality of the edition was no better than a trade.

  12. #732
    Senior Member Starting to Drool Incessantly Brian861's Avatar
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    I get the cost of the other letters due to all the bells and whistles associated with them. This lettered seems to be the tamest for lack of a better word so the cost seems higher from my POV. Doesn't matter in the scheme of things though as a lettered will never go unsold. I know I'd jump on one if I could afford it given the opportunity. A lot of this ride is about what's coming around the corner next. You never know with Paul. I've heard from several collectors say if the price point for the limiteds gets higher, it'd price them out of the game. Paul's been really consistent thus far IMO. I'm sure he's taking all these things into consideration.

    Just a side note. Martin created a separate thread for the new release but everything keeps ending up here. Should we just consolidate all things Suntup into one thread like over on TDT?

  13. #733
    Administrator Totally Insane Dan Hocker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    Yeah it all depends. But that's a selection (much like the artist) that opens the door to criticism for the publisher. I'd imagine it's so much easier when the author is alive and agrees to sign. The selection is made for the publisher. But when that's not the case, people will wonder and worry over the connection of the signer to the work. It's a legitimate question for sure. I'm thrilled to be getting a Chuck Palahniuk signature in Rosemary's Baby. And a Joyce Carol Oates signature in The Road. Though I see them as cherries on top. Awesome to have, and adding value for me, but secondary to the materials and production.

    Compared to Gauntlet's lettered edition of RUSTY PUPPY--the only thing that added value to the edition was the inclusion of James Purefoy's signature along with Lansdale's. The quality of the edition was no better than a trade.
    I think Rusty Puppy is a bad example though. You're comparing a $150 lettered edition to a $3,000 lettered edition. Also that quality statement is a bit of an unfair exaggeration. I haven't seen the Rusty Puppy lettered edition, but I would assume it was produced the same way Gauntlet's other recent lettered editions were. So at the very least it's probably bound in leather, has a ribbon page marker, and comes in a tray case. Which is generally what you can expect from a $100 - $150 lettered edition.
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  14. #734
    Administrator Totally Insane Dan Hocker's Avatar
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    I moved a bunch of posts to the other thread. I'm also gonna change the name of this thread to the book it's actually about.
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  15. #735
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement jeffingoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Hocker View Post
    I think Rusty Puppy is a bad example though. You're comparing a $150 lettered edition to a $3,000 lettered edition. Also that quality statement is a bit of an unfair exaggeration. I haven't seen the Rusty Puppy lettered edition, but I would assume it was produced the same way Gauntlet's other recent lettered editions were. So at the very least it's probably bound in leather, has a ribbon page marker, and comes in a tray case. Which is generally what you can expect from a $100 - $150 lettered edition.
    That is fair and I'll "walk it back" like our more level-headed politicians often do.

    I fully appreciate the price difference means that these two books can't be compared. And I wasn't really comparing them. I was speaking only about the value a signature brings and how it all depends on the context--who is signing and where it appears.

    It's true the book is bound in leather, comes in a tray case and has a ribbon page marker. But the paper quality is GOD AWFUL. I can't imagine these pages remaining white beyond 5 years. They're so flimsy it's like the book was printed on toilet paper. And don't even get me started on the DJ art! Don't EVEN get me started.

    If I were to compare along price points, then I'd take Suntup's AGE of Horns, or your gift edition of IT, or your numbered On This The Day of the Pig, or SST's The Listener over Gauntlet's Rusty Puppy any day. All of those books were less expensive than Rusty Puppy. That book made me unsubscribe from Barry's newsletter.

  16. #736
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    But when that's not the case, people will wonder and worry over the connection of the signer to the work. It's a legitimate question for sure. I'm thrilled to be getting a Chuck Palahniuk signature in Rosemary's Baby. And a Joyce Carol Oates signature in The Road. Though I see them as cherries on top. Awesome to have, and adding value for me,
    See, and for me that Palahniuk involvement diminishes my interest in the volume because I fail to see the legitimate connection between the introducer and the work. Oates is less a detriment because she and McCarthy are literary heavyweights, both members of a pretty rarified American fic-lit royalty, so to speak. But RB is a '70s icon of both film and prose, one that opened the door for mass-market horror; Palahniuk is neither a '70s figure nor a mass-market horror icon. He may know something about horror film, I don't know, but I suspect a lot of folks do. I'm sure he'll write a servicable, entertaining introduction, but his involvements feels tacked on, not organic to Levin's work, and I guess that organic nature is what it boils down to for me. To my mind, if it can't feel organic, then just leave it off altogether.

    Anyway, I don't mean to put a buzzkill on either Suntup or Jeff's enthusiasm for RB, so I'll leave it there. I made two longer comments r.e. this issueand IAL on page 276 of the Suntup thread at TDT.org if anyone's dying to hear me blather on more about it. http://www.thedarktower.org/palaver/...-Press/page276

  17. #737
    Administrator Totally Insane Dan Hocker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    That is fair and I'll "walk it back" like our more level-headed politicians often do.

    I fully appreciate the price difference means that these two books can't be compared. And I wasn't really comparing them. I was speaking only about the value a signature brings and how it all depends on the context--who is signing and where it appears.

    It's true the book is bound in leather, comes in a tray case and has a ribbon page marker. But the paper quality is GOD AWFUL. I can't imagine these pages remaining white beyond 5 years. They're so flimsy it's like the book was printed on toilet paper. And don't even get me started on the DJ art! Don't EVEN get me started.

    If I were to compare along price points, then I'd take Suntup's AGE of Horns, or your gift edition of IT, or your numbered On This The Day of the Pig, or SST's The Listener over Gauntlet's Rusty Puppy any day. All of those books were less expensive than Rusty Puppy. That book made me unsubscribe from Barry's newsletter.
    I definitely get what you're saying here. Every publisher has their own style, and it's not going to be for everyone. Take Suntup for example, I think he makes some beautiful books, but I personally don't care for "printed on boards". Which is what he's done for his gift edition slipcases (and binding too I think can't remember). PS Publishing does that as well, it's not necessarily bad, but for my personal tastes I'd much rather just have (the cases at least) be bound in cloth or some kind of synthetic and foil stamped.
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  18. #738
    Senior Member Lobotomized Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Hocker View Post
    I definitely get what you're saying here. Every publisher has their own style, and it's not going to be for everyone. Take Suntup for example, I think he makes some beautiful books, but I personally don't care for "printed on boards". Which is what he's done for his gift edition slipcases (and binding too I think can't remember). PS Publishing does that as well, it's not necessarily bad, but for my personal tastes I'd much rather just have (the cases at least) be bound in cloth or some kind of synthetic and foil stamped.
    While both PS Publishing and Suntup Press use printed on boards I look at them very differently. PS uses them for limited editions rather than just gift editions. PS uses them on the cases and the books. I can only speak to Horns from Suntup but the book is fabric and foil stamped. The quality of the slipcases is dramatically different as well. PS slipcases feel like cardboard wrapped with a photo. The Horns slipcase feels like a box with a quality image affixed, it is actually one of the nicest slipcases I have seen.

  19. #739
    Senior Member Lobotomized Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    That is fair and I'll "walk it back" like our more level-headed politicians often do.

    I fully appreciate the price difference means that these two books can't be compared. And I wasn't really comparing them. I was speaking only about the value a signature brings and how it all depends on the context--who is signing and where it appears.

    It's true the book is bound in leather, comes in a tray case and has a ribbon page marker. But the paper quality is GOD AWFUL. I can't imagine these pages remaining white beyond 5 years. They're so flimsy it's like the book was printed on toilet paper. And don't even get me started on the DJ art! Don't EVEN get me started.

    If I were to compare along price points, then I'd take Suntup's AGE of Horns, or your gift edition of IT, or your numbered On This The Day of the Pig, or SST's The Listener over Gauntlet's Rusty Puppy any day. All of those books were less expensive than Rusty Puppy. That book made me unsubscribe from Barry's newsletter.
    A guy from Chicago talking about 'level headed politicians' like he has ever seen one!

  20. #740
    Senior Member Lobotomized Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Hocker View Post
    I moved a bunch of posts to the other thread. I'm also gonna change the name of this thread to the book it's actually about.
    Thank you. I delayed opening the other thread until I knew the title of the book since I can't edit the header.

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