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Thread: Suntup Press - Third book

  1. #61
    Senior Member Lobotomized Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    I'm going to have to start selling books.
    Start selling body parts and use the money to buy more books!

  2. #62
    Senior Member Lobotomized Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsaenz24 View Post
    Personally, I’m not a fan of the dj art, so I would have to pass for that reason alone.
    Easy to solve. Buy the Limited or the Lettered as they do not come with a dust jacket!

  3. #63
    Senior Member Jeez! Don't you have anything better to do with your time? bookworm 1's Avatar
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    I'm skipping this one. Even the gift edition. I liked Horns but not enough to pay the price for this book. It also feels too close to a King release. I was hoping for an author other then Hill or King. While I love both authors work there are plenty of other writers out there. Anyway good luck to those who are going to spend Sunday getting in on this book.

  4. #64
    Junior Member Visitor Paul Suntup's Avatar
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    What's up everyone. It's your friendly neighborhood small press publisher who sells overpriced books! Ha Ha. How is everyone's day going!?

    I actually enjoy reading the comments on social media and forums, and for the most part, I keep my mouth shut. But hey, I thought I might offer a perspective from the publisher's standpoint.

    Here are some comments that caught my eye, and I apologize in advance for calling these out specifically.

    Spoiler!


    First off, just know that I respect everyone's opinions. We are all entitled to them, and to each their own.

    So if we talk about a book being "overpriced", my first question is, compared to what? Is there another book or two out there that has the same page count, uses the same materials and binding structure. The same printing process, the same enclosure, same print run, etc. If there is, and the price is significantly less than $675, then I guess you can say it's overpriced.

    I posted this on the DT forum earlier: One important thing to realize is that the Suntup numbered editions are basically lettered level books, at least from a production standpoint. And I've heard many say that the numbered Misery was better than some lettereds.

    With regard to the investment argument, I make books for the love of the book, and not for how much it will sell for on the secondary market. I know that many people purchase as an investment, and even to resell. I know some people who buy and sell in order to fund their collection. I don't have a problem with any of that, and I also don't price the book to weed out 'flippers'. I price the book based on production costs. It's just that when I make a book, all I care about is making the best book that I can, in a way that honors the work, and the author. Value tends to take care of itself. From what I've seen with Misery, some folks who sold did very well for themselves.

    On the point of previous limiteds of the same title. I feel strongly about not doing a book as a limited that has already been done. But there are definitely exceptions to that. When deciding on any book I do, it's one of the first things I consider. What has been done before. There were several reasons for deciding to do Horns, which I won't get into now.

    In terms of the author and/or subject matter, it doesn't matter to me whether the book has ascended to the level of a "classic" yet or not. Whether the author has won the Pulitzer, or is a new breakthrough author. Or dare I say, whether the book is signed or not (although I do understand the importance of the signature, and for living authors, I will always aim for that.) What matters to me is the story, the language, the written word. And beyond that, how it is produced, the beauty of the book, the paper, the materials, the printing, and so on. That is what drives me.

    To make the book that I wanted to make for Hill's Horns, this is what it took. I was not prepared to cut corners. The price is reflective of the cost of production. This is simply not a $350 - $500 book. In fact, it should have been priced higher, but as I said elsewhere, I answer to the book, not to the dollar.

    Anyway, I seem to have gone on longer than I should have again so I will end off. I know that our editions are not for everyone. And that's okay, really.

    Hope everyone has a great night!
    Last edited by Paul Suntup; 09-28-2018 at 12:03 AM.

  5. #65
    Senior Member Receiving Daily Medication TacomaDiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Suntup View Post
    What's up everyone. It's your friendly neighborhood small press publisher who sells overpriced books! Ha Ha. How is everyone's day going!?

    Hope everyone has a great night!
    Hi Paul -

    I appreciate you taking the time to compose your reply.

    I'm one of those that thought/thinks Horns was a bit pricey - especially compared to Misery (but I also think Misery was significantly under-priced for the record) but like you said, your numbered editions are basically lettered level books. I only own one lettered book from CD or Sub Press or PS or Gauntlet (not sure who else actually produces letters, so I'm only naming the three I'm aware of,) and Misery is heads and shoulders above the one that I own. I don't truly understand the appeal of most letters that seem to be offered (same or very similar signature page, identical cover, rarely a change in contents, and maybe a traycase instead of a slipcase) - there's nothing that makes them a different volume other than a different limitation.

    And not to knock any other publisher, your gift edition of Misery is leaps and bounds more impressive than that one lettered edition of some other book I have.

    It's obvious by the quality of the finished product that you love what you're doing, and you're doing something that you love. I don't think anything will ever be boilerplate and just another in a series, everything you've done so far is unique and specialized for the specific edition.

    Collectors seem to be a finicky lot - and so many of us think publishers or authors or whoever owe "us" something.

    I don't even know what I'm trying to say anymore - other than keep doing what you're doing, and those of us who can enjoy the fruits of your labor are lucky. And if something isn't for you, then great, it's not. There's so much of that "I hate something so you much be an awful person for enjoying it" going around.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Hocker View Post
    The price isn't really that insane when you consider the print run. 250 copies is really low, I'm honestly shocked when any publisher does a run that small, let alone for a low amount of money. Just knowing the time and effort that goes into producing the books. I can't remember which publisher it was (I don't think they are in business anymore) but they did like 150 copy runs for like $125. It's hardly seems worth the effort, given the number of titles you'd have to sell a year just to get by on that low of "profit per project". Just my thoughts though. I suspect they will sell out, just maybe not overnight.
    See I've always thought CD and SubPress do enormous print runs when you guys have limiteds at 500 or 1000 copies, but I cut my teeth in collecting without outfits like Delirium/DarkFuse, DRP, and so on, where 100-copy limiteds were standard and 250 was almost unheard of.

  7. #67
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement jeffingoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Suntup View Post

    "From my perspective, I think this is priced a little too high. I could see $550 or so."

    Hope everyone has a great night!
    Ah so we've been caught with our elbows on the bar chatting about someone else's business. Forgive us Paul, we're just gossiping and speculating. Since I'm one of the messages that caught your eye, I feel like I should explain myself. I tried to be careful in saying that from where I sit I thought it was a little too high. But my chair is not your chair. I went on to imagine your POV, and how you're trying to balance what the book demands and what the market will bear. I didn't mean that you intentionally set the price to deter flippers. I just saw that as a result of the price. The same way casual collectors might not bite at that price.

    Of course we want incredibly beautiful books for incredibly low prices. That just can't be. But I'm one of those who bought the numbered (opting for the payment plan) because I LOVE what you do. And I think it's worth it. So please don't read my comment and think I thought you were ripping us off. That's not it at all.

    I hope you sell out on Sunday.

    Imight dip back in and get a gift edition. I love that DJ.

  8. #68
    Junior Member Visitor Paul Suntup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TacomaDiver View Post
    Hi Paul -

    I appreciate you taking the time to compose your reply.

    I'm one of those that thought/thinks Horns was a bit pricey - especially compared to Misery (but I also think Misery was significantly under-priced for the record) but like you said, your numbered editions are basically lettered level books. I only own one lettered book from CD or Sub Press or PS or Gauntlet (not sure who else actually produces letters, so I'm only naming the three I'm aware of,) and Misery is heads and shoulders above the one that I own. I don't truly understand the appeal of most letters that seem to be offered (same or very similar signature page, identical cover, rarely a change in contents, and maybe a traycase instead of a slipcase) - there's nothing that makes them a different volume other than a different limitation.

    And not to knock any other publisher, your gift edition of Misery is leaps and bounds more impressive than that one lettered edition of some other book I have.

    It's obvious by the quality of the finished product that you love what you're doing, and you're doing something that you love. I don't think anything will ever be boilerplate and just another in a series, everything you've done so far is unique and specialized for the specific edition.

    Collectors seem to be a finicky lot - and so many of us think publishers or authors or whoever owe "us" something.

    I don't even know what I'm trying to say anymore - other than keep doing what you're doing, and those of us who can enjoy the fruits of your labor are lucky. And if something isn't for you, then great, it's not. There's so much of that "I hate something so you much be an awful person for enjoying it" going around.
    Thanks, yeah all good man. I appreciate you, and all of us who play in this sandbox.

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffingoff View Post
    Ah so we've been caught with our elbows on the bar chatting about someone else's business. Forgive us Paul, we're just gossiping and speculating. Since I'm one of the messages that caught your eye, I feel like I should explain myself. I tried to be careful in saying that from where I sit I thought it was a little too high. But my chair is not your chair. I went on to imagine your POV, and how you're trying to balance what the book demands and what the market will bear. I didn't mean that you intentionally set the price to deter flippers. I just saw that as a result of the price. The same way casual collectors might not bite at that price.

    Of course we want incredibly beautiful books for incredibly low prices. That just can't be. But I'm one of those who bought the numbered (opting for the payment plan) because I LOVE what you do. And I think it's worth it. So please don't read my comment and think I thought you were ripping us off. That's not it at all.

    I hope you sell out on Sunday.

    Imight dip back in and get a gift edition. I love that DJ.
    Jeff, all good brother. And no, not at all. I didn't take your comment that way. Nothing wrong with voicing opinions. I thought I would just offer up things from a different vantage point. Sort of balance the scales I guess. Thanks for supporting the press!

  9. #69
    Senior Member Jeez! Don't you have anything better to do with your time? bookworm 1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Suntup View Post
    What's up everyone. It's your friendly neighborhood small press publisher who sells overpriced books! Ha Ha. How is everyone's day going!?

    I actually enjoy reading the comments on social media and forums, and for the most part, I keep my mouth shut. But hey, I thought I might offer a perspective from the publisher's standpoint.

    Here are some comments that caught my eye, and I apologize in advance for calling these out specifically.

    Spoiler!


    First off, just know that I respect everyone's opinions. We are all entitled to them, and to each their own.

    So if we talk about a book being "overpriced", my first question is, compared to what? Is there another book or two out there that has the same page count, uses the same materials and binding structure. The same printing process, the same enclosure, same print run, etc. If there is, and the price is significantly less than $675, then I guess you can say it's overpriced.

    I posted this on the DT forum earlier: One important thing to realize is that the Suntup numbered editions are basically lettered level books, at least from a production standpoint. And I've heard many say that the numbered Misery was better than some lettereds.

    With regard to the investment argument, I make books for the love of the book, and not for how much it will sell for on the secondary market. I know that many people purchase as an investment, and even to resell. I know some people who buy and sell in order to fund their collection. I don't have a problem with any of that, and I also don't price the book to weed out 'flippers'. I price the book based on production costs. It's just that when I make a book, all I care about is making the best book that I can, in a way that honors the work, and the author. Value tends to take care of itself. From what I've seen with Misery, some folks who sold did very well for themselves.

    On the point of previous limiteds of the same title. I feel strongly about not doing a book as a limited that has already been done. But there are definitely exceptions to that. When deciding on any book I do, it's one of the first things I consider. What has been done before. There were several reasons for deciding to do Horns, which I won't get into now.

    In terms of the author and/or subject matter, it doesn't matter to me whether the book has ascended to the level of a "classic" yet or not. Whether the author has won the Pulitzer, or is a new breakthrough author. Or dare I say, whether the book is signed or not (although I do understand the importance of the signature, and for living authors, I will always aim for that.) What matters to me is the story, the language, the written word. And beyond that, how it is produced, the beauty of the book, the paper, the materials, the printing, and so on. That is what drives me.

    To make the book that I wanted to make for Hill's Horns, this is what it took. I was not prepared to cut corners. The price is reflective of the cost of production. This is simply not a $350 - $500 book. In fact, it should have been priced higher, but as I said elsewhere, I answer to the book, not to the dollar.

    Anyway, I seem to have gone on longer than I should have again so I will end off. I know that our editions are not for everyone. And that's okay, really.

    Hope everyone has a great night!
    Well said. I love my copy of Misery I also understand the cost and time that goes into putting these books together. While I am not purchasing Horns I look forward to seeing how it comes out and I also hope you do another blog like with Misery. Loved the insight that brought to the production of the book.

  10. #70
    Senior Member Lobotomized Martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Suntup View Post
    What's up everyone. It's your friendly neighborhood small press publisher who sells overpriced books! Ha Ha. How is everyone's day going!?

    I actually enjoy reading the comments on social media and forums, and for the most part, I keep my mouth shut. But hey, I thought I might offer a perspective from the publisher's standpoint.

    Here are some comments that caught my eye, and I apologize in advance for calling these out specifically.

    Spoiler!


    First off, just know that I respect everyone's opinions. We are all entitled to them, and to each their own.

    So if we talk about a book being "overpriced", my first question is, compared to what? Is there another book or two out there that has the same page count, uses the same materials and binding structure. The same printing process, the same enclosure, same print run, etc. If there is, and the price is significantly less than $675, then I guess you can say it's overpriced.

    I posted this on the DT forum earlier: One important thing to realize is that the Suntup numbered editions are basically lettered level books, at least from a production standpoint. And I've heard many say that the numbered Misery was better than some lettereds.

    With regard to the investment argument, I make books for the love of the book, and not for how much it will sell for on the secondary market. I know that many people purchase as an investment, and even to resell. I know some people who buy and sell in order to fund their collection. I don't have a problem with any of that, and I also don't price the book to weed out 'flippers'. I price the book based on production costs. It's just that when I make a book, all I care about is making the best book that I can, in a way that honors the work, and the author. Value tends to take care of itself. From what I've seen with Misery, some folks who sold did very well for themselves.

    On the point of previous limiteds of the same title. I feel strongly about not doing a book as a limited that has already been done. But there are definitely exceptions to that. When deciding on any book I do, it's one of the first things I consider. What has been done before. There were several reasons for deciding to do Horns, which I won't get into now.

    In terms of the author and/or subject matter, it doesn't matter to me whether the book has ascended to the level of a "classic" yet or not. Whether the author has won the Pulitzer, or is a new breakthrough author. Or dare I say, whether the book is signed or not (although I do understand the importance of the signature, and for living authors, I will always aim for that.) What matters to me is the story, the language, the written word. And beyond that, how it is produced, the beauty of the book, the paper, the materials, the printing, and so on. That is what drives me.

    To make the book that I wanted to make for Hill's Horns, this is what it took. I was not prepared to cut corners. The price is reflective of the cost of production. This is simply not a $350 - $500 book. In fact, it should have been priced higher, but as I said elsewhere, I answer to the book, not to the dollar.

    Anyway, I seem to have gone on longer than I should have again so I will end off. I know that our editions are not for everyone. And that's okay, really.

    Hope everyone has a great night!
    Paul,
    Thanks for offering your perspective, it is always appreciated.

  11. #71
    Senior Member Lobotomized Martin's Avatar
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    The more I think about it, the more I think I have to try for a limited of this. Although not my favorite Joe Hill novel, Heart Shaped Box still holds that slot, I really loved Horns. I did not purchase the PS limited so all I have is the signed 1st trade from Mr. Hills stop at Powell's. Mr. Hill is probably my top author currently so I am expecting to try for the limited. I got lucky with Misery so it could happen again!

  12. #72
    Senior Member Receiving Daily Medication c marvel's Avatar
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    How much will the Gift Edition of Suntup's Horns cost?


    Cap
    Books are weapons in the war of ideas.

  13. #73
    Senior Member Hearing Voices Tommy's Avatar
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    I think it's 85$

  14. #74
    Senior Member Lobotomized Martin's Avatar
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    Pricing from Suntup.press

    Artist Gift Edition
    ISBN: 978-1-7328448-0-3
    Publication price: $85

    Numbered Edition
    ISBN: 978-0-9988649-8-3
    Publication price: $675
    (Payment plan available:
    Four payments of $168.75*)

    Lettered Edition
    ISBN: 978-0-9988649-9-0
    Publication price: $2,995
    (Payment plan available:
    Four payments of $748.75*)

    Available for Pre-Order September 30, 2018 at 9am Pacific

  15. #75
    Senior Member Hearing Voices Tommy's Avatar
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    I stopped collecting Hill but if I still did, I would be in a mad scramble to get the numbered edition. Very cool design and I haven't even read the book yet!

  16. #76
    Senior Member Starting to Drool Incessantly Brian861's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Staad View Post
    I'm sorry to hear about this. I am an only child (so no nephews) but we lost my cousins son unexpectedly at 21. It was and is tough.
    It is very tough. My condolences to you and yours as well.

  17. #77
    Senior Member Starting to Drool Incessantly Brian861's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Martin View Post
    Much to young to die. I am so sorry. I have a niece who is 19 and a nephew who is 17 that I have helped raise and could imagine what it would be like to lose one of them.
    Thanks, Martin.

  18. #78
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement jeffingoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Martin View Post
    The more I think about it, the more I think I have to try for a limited of this. Although not my favorite Joe Hill novel, Heart Shaped Box still holds that slot, I really loved Horns. I did not purchase the PS limited so all I have is the signed 1st trade from Mr. Hills stop at Powell's. Mr. Hill is probably my top author currently so I am expecting to try for the limited. I got lucky with Misery so it could happen again!
    You’ll definitely have a shot. There are those who have folded because of the price and there are 65 more copies available than there was for Hill House.

  19. #79
    Senior Member 1st Rubber Room Confinement mhatchett's Avatar
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    I don't think I've ever overpaid for a book that I really wanted...I hope to God wife my never finds this post LOL!!!!

  20. #80
    Senior Member Receiving Daily Medication TacomaDiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mhatchett View Post
    I don't think I've ever overpaid for a book that I really wanted...I hope to God wife my never finds this post LOL!!!!
    No kidding. I’m giving some serious consideration to buying this book but am afraid of the “you spent how much?” Conversation.

    Something something forgiveness something permission.

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